Topic: Feedback..

[darkdefier]

www.sinmok.net

Feedback and suggestions are appreciated..

Updated: 13/11/06

[gryphon]

I can't waith untill you start with GoLive

btw. Your host is slow

[darkdefier]

Golife?

Is that a GUI editor? I dont plan on using one of those.

[gryphon]

how come you dislike them so much ?

[darkdefier]

It gets in the way of learning how to code them properly.

[gryphon]

true, notepad stil is the best way to learn HTML just like BASIC or Compiler is one of the best ways to learn to programm code. But then when you'r passed that stage Visual Studio makes your life so much easyer

[darkdefier]

Hehe so in a sense...learn to run, before you walk.

[gryphon]

nope. . learn to walk first. . but then don't be ashamed to drive a car and save some time

[Timenn]

Ho ho, I got to disagree on this one with you gryphon. WYSIWYG's are clumsy and may appear to create a decent page, until you load it up in another browser and everything is chaos. WYSIWYG's deliver bad code.
Notepad is clumsy too, it has one of the worst fonts and you can hardly do anything with it. At least use Wordpad.
But I would advice a text editor with at least some syntax highlighting. That you don't use WYSIWYG's doesn't mean you can have some visual aides.
The one I use is jEdit. (You have to have Java Development Kit installed, but hey, it's all free!)

As for feedback. The theme looks good, you only used black and white, but at the right places. It looks the same in different browsers. Some tips though:
- Try working with CSS stylesheets. They make it easier to modify your site visually without going through all the html files, and you can do alot more styling with them than just HTML.
- You seem to have centered all the text. While this works well for headlines, it makes reading more difficult in general. You can still have text appear only in the middle area of the page, while have it aligned left. Use tables or div-elements for example.

As for your host... bad host means bad host admin...

[gryphon]

That whould entirely depend on how you use the GUI editor to create a webpage.

Most wysiwyg editors have a code tab so you can just edit it manually. It's the combination of looking at the layout, and being able to edit the code in one program that I like. Next to that, Frontpage for example has the ability to cut all that extra code stuff it put's in it out of.

I prefer MS Visual Studio to do the work. Because it doesn't only do code highlighting, but also let's you edit the code and view a preview. No need to settle for a program that only does code highlighting when you can have 3 features to use.

And I must admit, I have never seen any designer (besides your local home programmer) use something else then Macromedia, Cocoon or my personall two favorites VS or NetBeans. Now I am not a webdesigner. But the fact that most people I work with who have that job tend to use a graphical editor of some sort is still weird

Think it all depends on the website you are making. Design sites and large portals will hardly be created with an editor that doesn't do more then code highlighting. Smaller PHP, HTML or even XML sites can easy be created with a simpel code editor without sacrificing to much of your time.

Next to that. Being incompatible is not just the fault of any editor. It's also the browsers fault of interpreting code it's own way.

[darkdefier]

Timenn, I fail to see the difference between using notepad and wordpad.

@ gryphon: it's fairly simple. Why preview the page in the preview tab? Why not just open a browser and refresh

Edit: timenn, I am using CSS. Although, right now, im only using it at the level of knowing what im doing. I'm not into the more complex thing yet. That comes later on in my course.

[gryphon]

@ gryphon: it's fairly simple. Why preview the page in the preview tab? Why not just open a browser and refresh

You'll find out when you start writing PHP pages.

It's a matter of personall preference. I prefer a programm that let's me easy create a default template, then manual edit it for the code that needs to be in it. Together with a preview of how it looks. Try to preview a PHP page for example in a browser quickly. It won't work unless you install a webserver on your computer.

Don't get me wrong. I also started with Notepad to create HTML pages and was still using Notepad for my first XSLT / XML stuff. But alfter you have learned the basics I think a GUI editor saves you a lot of time when you are designing complex portals and allows you to implement a more advanced feature quickly.

Just curious. can you give an example of a website (with good layout and more then basic functions) that isn't created with a GUI ?

[darkdefier]

i'll ask around

[Timenn]

Websites written without a GUI? Any website that makes decent use of a scripting language. Take Wikipedia for instance. Know that I don't consider a program that lets you write code and preview it on the fly immediately as a GUI. It's just a text processor with some built in (or an extension/add on)

As for templates, basic rule in programming is that if you need a template all the time, you are probably creating alot of redundant data. You write something one time, and then you either make a loop or work with includes.

As for incompatibility, you can't blame browser to try to fix errors in pages on their own way. With my Firefox I have an extension running that checks the amount of errors and inconsistencies in page codes. Guess which site is the only site I have seen so far that does never have either of them? Wikipedia... (MediaWiki)

Ofcourse it is also a matter of preference, but this discussion would be sadly short if we didn't try to criticise each other's preferences.
As for the difference between NotePad and WordPad. It's a matter of preference mostly. I use Wordpad because the font it uses to display raw text (so no markup) is better visible than NotePad's. Also I believe that Wordpad is able to reserve more memory than Notepad for text files.

Great that you started working with CSS. Don't worry about the complex stuff, it will all come by itself. Whenever you have finished something you want to experiment on doing more, it's natural curiosity.

[gryphon]

I just find it strange that on forums most people really like the non GUI editors. But then most websites are still created with a GUI.

Just was in a meeting today. . looks like I have to manage a website project starting next week. As if I even like to do that. It needs to be a website / webshop / intranet which directly connects to the companies products database. The current persone leading the project wasn't capable enough and some one though it was a funny idea to suggest me. ..

[darkdefier]

Time to get the books out eh

[gryphon]

Don't worry. . they where never in the closet

[Locutus]

I was amazed btw bij the beta for microsofts Frontpage replacement. It's called Microsoft Expression.
It looks more like the Dreamweaver interface... and delivers somewhat clean code...

On the other hand... It's still Microsoft's frontpage replacement.

(not that it has anything to do with this discussion )